holy shit.

http://lifestyle.msn.com/relationships/couplesandmarriage/articlecosmo.aspx?cp-documentid=8361783&GT1=32001

this was on of the articles for today's msn homepage. just opened it.

david and i basically had a two hour conversation earlier today discussing exactly what this article talks about, down to the points.

it started with a story about a friend of mine who dated a 38 year-old guy working in the industry for 2 years. near the end, she wanted to know where this relationship was going, ie marriage. he was always very noncommittal, citing various reasons, blaming bad experiences in the past, etc., but never really seeming sure that he was in this for the long haul and determined to make this work. after a few months of these discussions, my friend said she had a real soul-searching moment when she asked herself if her boyfriend were to turn around and ask her to marry him after all these discussions that left her feeling frustrated, would she want to marry him? as she put it, she realized, "what little girl grows up dreaming of the day when she gets to badger a man into marrying her?" well put, i thought. very well put.

so she realized, it was over. there was no way she wanted to be with this man, because she wanted a man who knew without a doubt, within every part of his being, that he WANTED to try to make a relationship work. it's not about doubts of if a relationship will ultimately work because nothing in life is guaranteed, but it's about not having doubts about whether or not each person is willing to work together and make the strongest, most committed effort possible.

david thought my friend didn't give her boyfriend enough time to think about it, and my point was that it didn't matter because they'd been together for 2 years, he obviously wasn't ready or had other priorities (career) that were in front of her and could potentially always be in front of her, and at the end of the day, there are men out there who know without a doubt that they're ready to give 100% to a girl who's worthy (like the guy she's with now who realized within the first week that she was someone he could see himelf with for the long haul), so why settle for a man who you have to badger to marry you, versus the man who knows without a doubt that he wants to marry you? for a girl with healthy self-esteem, it's a no brainer.

so this led to a debate and i was trying to explain why men do and don't commit. my theory was that men who get to the place where they're ready to have a real relationship and have gotten their career/life in order will usually settle with the next girl who walks into his life who's a suitable partner. it's a lot about the girl but it's also about timing. there are so many stories of girls who wait for a guy and wait for a guy who's not sure about commitment. unless the guy is young and is still figuring himself out or still has specific career objectives he needs to finish first before he can prioritize the relationship, a lot of times when guys drag their feet, it's not that they aren't sure about commitment...they're unsure about committing with YOU. i see a lot of examples of guys in their 30's who have gotten their careers work out and are in good places in their lives, and when they suddenly meet the right girl, they make declarations pretty early of their desire to settle down, and they're persistent and tenacious. it's actually enough examples for me to not know which is the exception and which is the rule between mature men who are sure of what they want, and those who need extended time to figure it out once they're in a relationship. perhaps the best poll would be one if you asked elderly couples who have been together for decades and have had a strong, relationship that continually grew and evolved, if the man knew early on that this was a woman he wanted to partner with.

i really think for a man WANT to commit (because there are a lot of poor souls out there who commit even though they don't want to or because they feel they have to, and that always blows my mind), he has to hit the perfect storm of meeting the right girl at the exact time in which he's tired of a certain way of life, wanting something deeper, challenging and with more opportunities for him to grow, and in a place where he's fulfilled other priorities and he is able to make room in his life for another person and make a partnership a top priority. it's about the right person, but more so, it's about the right person at the right time. and like the hunters that men are, once they find that person and know they want them, there's really no stopping them. any other girl who gets caught with this man when he's not ready, even if she's a great girl and someone who he would do well with, is kind of shit out of luck. maybe a guy will turn around once his other priorities are settled and he figures out what he wants, but often, if you're the girl who supported a guy while he went through his struggles, he's more likely to leave you and marry the next girl who sees him only when he's achieved his goals and is this "better" version of himself in his mind, not the girl who saw him as an incomplete man struggling with his doubts and fears as he attempted to reach his goals. yeah, it's fucked up. but us good girls have all been there...the training girlfriend who makes a guy a perfect partner...for someone else. i think if a guy has his life basically in order but he doesn't want to commit, he's not unsure of commitment in general per se, he's unsure about committing with YOU. for whatever reason, he's not sure you're the one, and whether it's chemistry or timing or some combination of both, you really want the guy who's in the right place and knows himself well enough to really be sure. because a guy who is sure and determined is going to be the guy who will be willing to look at a partnership realistically, will be willing to work through the hard parts, and will be happy to see the relationship evolve to a real place with real emotions and real people.

so we had this long discussion and i threw in examples from my experiences and observerations of married couples and he was pretty stubborn. he thinks sometimes girls don't give a guy enough time to figure it out. again, yes, if the guy is gunning for a specific goal (ie trying to finish med school) or is young and wants to know who he is first before he makes a serious promise, but otherwise, he's just not into the girl enough and so already, the relationship is doomed. so i asked him. "i know you've played around and you've also been in long term relationships that worked well. but why aren't you with one of thoe girls now?"

he said, "i wasn't sure if i wanted to commit."

then i asked him, "was it you you were unsure of, or was it the girls?"

he started laughing. "okay, i get it. if a guy is sure that he wants to be with a specific girl, he's going to do everything he possibly can to make it work."

i was really happy. "exactly! and if he's dragging his feet, chances are, he suspects you're not the one for him, no matter how great you are, so it's better to find someone who wants you and is therefore willing and ready to go through the difficult challenges of partnership to really make it work."

and then i saw this article's on the homepage and sent it to him and we were both cracking up.

today was definitely a cool day.

it's been 3 days in a row of really challenging and illuminating days.

i want to thank all the people in my life for being unique and amazing.